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power to the internet



They are quite lacking in longevity and density.

Which is fine if you have enough space and adequate maintenance to 
change them out and they are only a bridge for local generation.

Remote installations do not typically have these characteristics.

Pretty much every basement mux or other RT telco installation I have 
ever seen had the original battery setup still in place and lasted 
approximately 3 seconds when the lights went off. I try to put them into 
my batteries whenever possibly.

Further, many fios/cable customer NID devices do come with batteries, 
but they are usually lead acid, often the telco charges to replace the 
battery and they are typically only there to power the POTS lines on the 
NID.

Joe


Baldur Norddahl wrote:
> What is wrong with lead acid battery backup? Seems to be exceedingly 
> stable from my experience. We have all our equipment on -48V DC and 
> have never had a power interruption at any site.
>
> The requirements here are 48 hours of backup by law. Telecom is 
> declared to be part of emergency and defense, so they put in a 
> requirement for resilience.
>
> Regards
>
> Baldur
>
>
> tor. 26. dec. 2019 11.33 skrev Joe Maimon <jmaimon at jmaimon.com 
> <mailto:jmaimon at jmaimon.com>>:
>
>     Unless telecom infrastructure has been diligently changing out the
>     lead
>     acid battery approach at all their remote terminals, powered gpon,
>     hfc
>     and antennae plants will never last more than minutes. If at all.
>
>     A traditional car has between a 100-200amp alternator @12volts
>
>     How much generating capacity can you get out of a typical hybrid?
>
>     Self-isolating and re-tieing inverters. Economic household ATS
>     systems.
>     Do those exist?
>
>     Enough independent distributed capacity and now comes the ability to
>     create grid islands. How might that look?
>
>     Electric grid shortage is likely coming to NYC, courtesy of folk of
>     certain political persuasion and their love of stone age era
>     living. IP
>     decommissioning.
>
>     If you have CO loop copper, keep it.
>
>     Joe
>
>     Don Gould wrote:
>     > This is a very short term problem.
>     >
>     > The market is going to fill with battery storage sooner rather than
>     > later.
>     >
>     > Solar is just exploding.
>     >
>     > Your car will "house tie".
>     >
>     > 6G will solve your data problem.
>     >
>     > D
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > --
>     > Don Gould
>     > 5 Cargill Place
>     > Richmond
>     > Christchurch, New Zealand
>     > Mobile/Telegram: + 64 21 114 0699
>     > www. <http://www.tusker.net.au/>bowenvale.co.nz
>     <http://bowenvale.co.nz>
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     > -------- Original message --------
>     > From: Michael Thomas <mike at mtcc.com <mailto:mike at mtcc.com>>
>     > Date: 26/12/19 2:33 PM (GMT+12:00)
>     > To: nanog at nanog.org <mailto:nanog at nanog.org>
>     > Subject: power to the internet
>     >
>     >
>     >
>     https://www.politico.com/news/2019/12/25/california-power-shutoffs-089678
>     >
>     >
>     > This article details some of the issues with California's "new
>     reality"
>     > of planned blackouts. One of the big things that came to light with
>     > these blackouts is that our network infrastructure's resilience is
>     > pretty lacking. While I was (surprisingly to me) ok with my DSL
>     > connection out in the boonies, lots and lots of people with cable
>     > weren't so lucky. And I'm not sure how bad the situation is with
>     > cellular infrastructure, but I assume it's not much better than
>     cable.
>     > And I wouldn't doubt that other DSL deployments go dark when
>     power is
>     > down. I have no clue with fiber.
>     >
>     > So I guess what I'm wondering is what can we do about this? What
>     should
>     > we do about this? These days IP access is not just convenience,
>     it's the
>     > way we go about our lives, just like electricity itself. At base, it
>     > seems to me that network operators should be required to keep
>     the lights
>     > on in blackouts just like POTS operators do now. If I have power to
>     > light my modem or charge in my phone, I should be able to get
>     onto the
>     > net. That seems like table stakes.
>     >
>     > One of the things we learned also is that the blackouts seem to last
>     > between 2-3 days apiece. I happen to have a generator since I'm
>     out in
>     > the boonies and our power gets cut regularly because of snow,
>     but not
>     > everyone has that luxury. I kind of want to think that my
>     router+modem
>     > use about 20 watts, so powering it up would take about 1.5kwh for 3
>     > days. a quick google look shows that I'd probably need to shell
>     out $500
>     > or so for a battery of that capacity, and that's doesn't include
>     your
>     > phones, laptops, tv's, etc power needs. What does that mean?
>     That is a
>     > major expense for a lot of people.
>     >
>     > On the bright side, I hear that power generator companies stocks
>     have
>     > gone through the roof.
>     >
>     > On the dark side, this is probably coming to a lot more states and
>     > countries due to climate change. Australia. Sigh.
>     >
>     > Mike
>     >
>