[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]

William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help if you can.



How would this be legally different than receiving the illegal content
in an envelope and anonymously forwarding the envelope via the post
office?  I am pretty sure you are still liable since you were the
sender.  I realize that there are special postal regulations but I think
that agreeing to forward anything for anyone sight unseen is pretty
risky and I think you will have a hard time pulling of the "service
provider" defense if you are not selling services and are not licensed
as a carrier.

Steven Naslund

-----Original Message-----
From: Patrick W. Gilmore [mailto:patrick at ianai.net] 
Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2012 10:45 AM
To: NANOG list
Subject: Re: William was raided for running a Tor exit node. Please help
if you can.

On Nov 29, 2012, at 11:17 , Barry Shein <bzs at world.std.com> wrote:

> Back in the early days of the public internet we didn't require any 
> id to create an account, just that you found a way to pay us. We had 
> anonymous accts some of whom dropped by personally to pay their bill, 
> some said hello but I usually didn't know their names and that's how 
> they wanted it, I'd answer "hello <ACCOUNT>", whatever their login was

> if I recognized them. Some mailed in something, a mail order, even 
> currency tho that was rare but it did happen, or had someone else drop

> by to pay in cash (that is, no idea if they were local.)
> 
> LEO occasionally served a warrant for information, usually child porn 
> biz (more than just accessing child porn, selling it) tho I don't 
> remember any anonymous accts being involved.

"Mere conduit" defense.  (Please do not anyone mention "common carrier
status" or the like, ISPs are _not_ common carriers.)


> I never expected to be held accountable for anyone's behavior unless I

> was knowingly involved somehow (just the usual caveat.) LEO never 
> showed any particular interest in the fact that we were ok with 
> anonymous accounts. If I was made aware of illegal activities we'd 
> shut them off, didn't really happen much, maybe some credible 
> "hacking" complaint on occasion.

How do you "shut off" a Tor "account"?


> It's funny, it's all illusion like show business. It's not hard to set

> up anonymous service, crap, just drop in at any wi-fi hotspot, many 
> just ask you to click that you accept their T&Cs and you're on. Would 
> they raid them, I was just using one at a major hospital this week 
> that was just like that, if someone used that for child porn etc? But 
> I guess stick your nose out and say you're specifically offering anon 
> accts and watch out I guess.

Do you think if the police found out child pr0n was being served from a
starbux they wouldn't confiscate the equipment from that store?

--
TTFN,
patrick