What's happened to my Favorite List? It's Gotten Pretty Ugly

From: STUART GOLDSTEIN ^lt;[email protected]>
Date: 03/12/05-02:52:10 PM Z
Message-id: <20050312205210.2367.qmail@web53806.mail.yahoo.com>

Hans please don't take this personally, but in light
of Sandy King's comments about keeping emails on
subject about alt processes and topics close to alt
(like digi negs, cameras, lenses), shouldn't Hans'
response to Mark have been sent privately and not to
the list? It had absolutely nothing to do with alt.

Also what about all the emails about SPE in Portland
-- I know that some list members are going but
some/many/most of us aren't. Last time I looked, an
SPE convention isn't really an alt topic either. How
many exchanges have we had on that none alt subject?
100? 150? 200? ?????

I will be happy to off my apologies if someone can
explain to me how those emails were alt.

We need to have one set of rules and be consistent.
Gordon, help!

Remember the delete button!

I'm tired of the bickering. I've been on the list well
before JMC left (I think I've been on since 1998 or
1999), I just don't post much.

I remember being outraged and confused by some of
JMC's last postings. Especially the c-word ones (yes,
I'll use that word myself when I get *REALLY* p-offed
but would never post something like that to the list).
At the end, I felt the listminders should have stopped
her before she finally "died".

I also remember her posting about paper-making or
paper in general. I found that earlier posting
informative. It's taking the good with the bad.

But really now, have we been exposed to too much alt
chems that civility has been replaced with name
calling, yelling, and finger pointing? All of which
seems to go on forever?

I often wish that Gordon would give some list members,
male and female, a time out. Failing that, if Gordon
is willing to fly me to the offending member's home,
I'm willing to personally supervise that member's time
out. Of course, that person would have to teach me
whatever they knew about the alt area they knew the
most about. I mean I can't waste my time being the
supernanny, there has to be something in it for me
besides the free airfare.

I remember coming to this list after I took a one day
cyanotype workshop and then another one for PT/PD. I
knew next to nothing but I thought the list was a
great way to learn about alt. At that time I didn't I
didn't feel scared to ask a member a question (as long
as I kept it short and to the point). And many, many
members were gracious to respond and point me in the
right direction.

But I'm not sure if I was a newbie to the list whether
I'd post a question as fearlessly.

Case in point, that whole exchange a few months ago
about ULF, who knew what and when (sounded a little
like Iran-Contra and the Reagan Era), and if you
didn't know what it meant you shouldn't
contribute...blah blah blah.

I don't know about anybody else but there are days I
can't remember what day of the week it is. So I might
have known the meaning of an acrynym at earlier time
but with everything going on I might have
forgetten...a little refresher wouldn't hurt. And I
just might know something about ULF but I wasn't
familiar with the acrynym.

But if I were a newbie and saw that whole series of
exchanges (or the JMC one), man, I'd probably
unsubscribe from the list (and probably incorrectly
because I was in hurry just to get off and away from
the acrimony).

I wish I had some witty anecdote to close with. Wait I
do -- how lucky for everyone. I just completed a
driving re-education class (to reduce, minimally, my
NJ insurance premium). I took the class through AARP
although I am not a member and am not old enough (yet)
to become a member. One of my fellow students had
several questions. Each time, she would raise her hand
and wait for the instructor to call on her. When she
asked her third or fourth question, several of our
classmates started shushing her. At first I thought
they were shushing somebody else t but no it was the
student asking the question. Nice huh. Pretty ugly
behavior as well

One thing I always remember, I have a delete button
and can delete any email I'm not interested in. And I
do that with postings from some members. I'll let you
all wonder whether you're the member that gets
instantly deleted when your posting appears in the

Of course, you can send me email and see if I respond.
But if I don't respond is it because the email didn't
get through or because I'm not responding to you? To
paraphrase Dirty Harry, "Go ahead kid, do ya feel

So who's going to meet me at that bar in Portland for


--- Hans Klemmer <hansklemmer@mac.com> wrote:
> Mark,
> When you buy a round then I buy a round, that is
> called reciprocity.
> When one of us runs out of money and can't buy the
> next round, that's
> reciprocity failure!
> Hans
> "In a Democratic society man takes advantage of his
> fellow man... In a
> Communistic society, it's just the opposite."
> W.R.Crawford
> On Mar 12, 2005, at 10:11 AM, Ender100@aol.com
> wrote:
> > Hi Hans,
> >
> > hehehehe it would seem we would get into an
> endless loop—or be looped
> > endlessly.
> >
> > Mark
> > In a message dated 3/11/05 11:41:56 AM,
> hansklemmer@mac.com writes:
> >
> >
> >
> > Mark,
> > Then do we have to buy you a beer when we need a
> bathroom break? And
> > then you buy a round and so on and so on...
> >
> > Hans
> >
> >
> >
> >

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Received on Sat Mar 12 14:52:20 2005

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